What Comes After the First Glimpse? Loch Kelly on Waking Up vs. Waking With

Evelyn Reed · 2026-09-15

Most of us have had at least one moment where everything just... stopped. The mental chatter quieted, and for a few seconds, there was only openness. Maybe it happened on a hike, in the shower, or during a particularly good conversation. And then, just as quickly, it was gone. That's the "first glimpse." And according to meditation teacher Loch Kelly, it's not the finish line. It's the starting block. In a recent conversation with host Michael Taft, Kelly unpacked a distinction that doesn't get nearly enough airtime: the difference between "waking up" and "waking with." If you've ever wondered why a profound meditation experience didn't permanently change your daily life, this is the piece you're probably missing. ### Waking Up vs. Waking With: What's the Difference? "Waking up" is the classic awakening experience. You recognize openness, stillness, and the absence of a separate self. It's spacious. It's freeing. And for many people, it feels like the whole point of the spiritual path. But here's the thing. You can wake up and still get irritated in traffic twenty minutes later. That's where "waking with" comes in. Instead of transcending appearances, you start to see them as inseparable from awake awareness itself. Thoughts, emotions, the sound of your neighbor's leaf blower—none of it is separate from the awareness you've recognized. This is sometimes called "one taste." Everything belongs. Kelly's point is simple but profound: waking up is the recognition. Waking with is the integration. One without the other tends to leave you with a beautiful memory and not much else. ### Flow States Are Not the Same as Awakening People often confuse flow states with spiritual awakening. They're related, but they're not the same thing. - **Flow states** happen when you're fully absorbed in an activity—writing, running, playing music. The self-conscious narrator quiets down, and action feels effortless. - **Awakening** is about recognizing the awareness that all experience arises within—whether you're in flow or stuck in a boring meeting. - **Waking with** takes it a step further, seeing both flow and frustration as expressions of the same awake awareness. Flow is wonderful. But it's temporary. You can't stay in a flow state forever, no matter how many productivity hacks you try. Awake awareness, on the other hand, doesn't come and go. As Kelly puts it, the goal isn't to have more peak experiences. It's to live from the ground that never leaves. ### Why This Matters for Your Daily Practice If you've been chasing glimpses—more retreats, more techniques, more intensity—you might be missing the quieter work of integration. Waking with isn't glamorous. It's folding the laundry with awareness. It's feeling annoyance without making it a problem. It's noticing the ordinary texture of your life as already awake. Kelly suggests starting small. Glimpse the openness. Then, instead of trying to hold onto it, let it meet the messiness of your day. That's where the real transformation happens. So the next time you catch a moment of stillness, don't cling to it. Let it come with you into the next conversation, the next email, the next sink full of dishes. That's waking with. And it's available right now.